I talked to Cindy in preparation for Teen Read Week, but her schedule and mine didn’t work out to post this during the actual Teen Read Week (which was last week)—so we’ll continue celebrating “reading beyond reality” beyond the one week, and we hope you do too.

Stacy: I read Silver Phoenix and I loved it. I cringed for Ai Ling several times—you aren’t afraid to put her in awkward situations! Silver Phoenix is set in the Kingdom of Xia, a culture much like that of ancient China. You’ve talked about this on the Enchanted Inkpot, but I wonder if you’d talk to us a little about the challenges of writing a girl character in a historical setting, especially one that’s misogynistic or paternalistic, and how you had to navigate that culture to be able to tell the story you wanted to tell. Was it hard keeping within the bounds of a girl’s prescribed role? You broke a few boundaries by having Ai Ling set off on her journey alone to save her father, but she’s very traditional in other ways. How did you push at those strictures to create a strong character who girls today could identify with?

Cindy Pon: It really was a challenge, Stacy. I had done research for this novel and was very well aware that a girl’s place was within the inner quarters — at home, but not even all of the home, but the women’s part, away from the public and the men’s domain.

I struggled with trying to come to terms with what my book was, but became mired under historical details that would have rendered Silver Phoenix impossible to tell–as I wanted to tell it.

I realized then that I wasn’t writing a historical. Or a historical fantasy. Silver Phoenix is inspired by ancient China, but it doesn’t take place in China or in an actual time in history. In this way, I was able to keep the feel of China but still tell Ai Ling’s story. Many details like breast binding and how hair is worn were made up by me and contributed to the Xia culture.

I most certainly wasn’t writing a Chinese story. I’m Chinese-American and I think the story relates my viewpoint. I found the dichotomy of obeying your parents and needing to grow and become independent easy to relate to–a universal theme of growing up. Whether the reader is willing to “buy” my story is a personal choice.

Why did you write a book set in this culture? Were there myths, legends, or fairy tales that you drew on? You’ve got quite a range of demons and other supernatural beings who show up—what were your influences?

When the idea of this novel came to me, I had just begun studying chinese brush painting and becoming more interested in learning about the art and culture. (I did take classes in Chinese studies in university but that was more recent times, like the cultural revolution, etc.) Fantasy has and always will be my first love genre. So I thought I’d write a story that combined these two interests.

Something like the snake demon is very much rooted in Chinese folklore. The one armed tribe and passing the land of women, those were all in a very old book that most Chinese don’t even know today. But I also loved creating monsters, and most of them were from my imagination — usually a creature or situation that I’d personally find terrifying (drowning, death and corpses…).

I read that you were born in Taiwan and grew up here in the States.  And you’ve mentioned to me that you used “old brother” in Silver Phoenix instead of “big brother” or “older brother” as an honorific because it’s a direct translation from the Chinese. Do you feel that knowing the language, or being a part of a modern culture descended from the culture you’re writing in helped you to craft your setting more fully? Did you travel to China (or to Taiwan, perhaps) at some point to visit historical sites? What worldbuilding advice might you give to writers on creating a fully realized setting as you’ve done in Silver Phoenix?

I think so. For another writer, they may have to research more within the culture they want to write, if it isn’t something they grew up with. (But research is a fun part of writing!) I wish I had visited China! But no, one day. I had to rely on some magnificent travel books with gorgeous fotos and online research as well as films to immerse myself in the feel of the story. I visited Taiwan and did get a chance to visit a museum to look at Chinese brush paintings.

When you were a teen, did you read much fantasy? Why or why not?

Oh, yes. It was my favorite genre! At least, the stories that made a lasting impression. I loved Tad Williams, Terry Brooks, Tolkien, Madeleine L’engle, Piers Anthony, Anne Rice, Stephen King, Dean Koontz (I guess latter more horror?). As an adult I discovered Ursula Le Guin, Neil Gaiman, Megan Whalen Turner, Ellen Kushner.

I honestly wonder if there will be a day when I can write a novel without fantastic elements in it. I think fantasy (and speculative fiction) is so liberating. You are only limited by your own imagination in the worlds and stories you create.

Was it important for you as a teen reader to read books in which there were people like you, to find a personal connection to the story? Was there a time when you first felt that sense of connection to a book, a sense that you identified with the character or felt more comfortable with the setting, that you could tell us about?

Culturally and ethnically? No. I can’t think of a book growing up that I loved that had even one single Asian or Asian-American character in it. I didn’t even think about it. I couldn’t get a Barbie doll that looked like me, why should I expect to read a story that had someone like me culturally?

It doesn’t mean that I didn’t relate to my books  and stories. I loved Island of the Blue Dolphins by Scott O’Dell, and the heroine is of a culture and from a place I am unfamiliar with, but I still sympathized with her plight. And another favorite series by Noel Streatfield had girls in England — all learning something (like dancing or ballet) that I knew nothing about. And A Little Princess by Frances H. Burnett also based in England. Could read that over and over.

This is why stories are so wonderful to me. If the author did her job, you can love and relate, even to something that isn’t exactly like you. And I’ll say the same of Silver Phoenix. You may know nothing about the Chinese culture or having to be forced into a betrothal, but I don’t think that means you wouldn’t like or relate to Ai Ling’s story. One of the biggest compliments I received was from a reluctant reader who wasn’t so into this Asian fantasy book, read it and loved it. That made me so happy!

The theme of Teen Read Week is “Read Beyond Reality.” How does reading — not necessarily fantasy and science fiction, but since you’re a fantasy buff, feel free to answer about that — take you beyond your own reality? What do you look for in a good book?

So I love to watch foreign movies. [Stacy: Me too!] And I don’t mind reading subtitles one bit. I’m a bit boggled when I learn that the average American doesn’t like foreign films or subtitles. When I read, I love escapism, and if I can learn something about a different culture or become immersed in the author’s world and characters, that is the best experience for me.

How would you encourage teen readers to read beyond reality?

I’ve read beyond my comfort zone and favorite genres since deciding to become a writer — and I would encourage all readers to do the same. If you only read romance, try some mystery. If you only read high fantasy, try contemporary or urban fantasy, etc. You never know if you discover a book you love you may never have tried before.

Tell us a little about the teens who read your book. Is it a new experience for them to read about an Asian protagonist, especially to read fantasy set in an Asian setting? What kinds of reactions have you gotten so far?

I had fans who enjoy manga and films such as spirited away that loved my novel. I’ve had quite a few readers who don’t read fantasy, much less ones with a historical asian inspired feel, but did and really enjoyed it as well. I also met some boys who read my book–and that always makes me happy!

Why is multicultural literature important to you? Why do you think it’s important for the teens who read your books?

It’s important because I’m of a multicultural background and most of us live in a multicultural world. I think reading beyond what you know and what you’re used to and what you’re comfortable with helps us to grow not only as readers but as people.

You’re a literacy advocate and you run an excellent blog highlighting women writers of color, reaching out to reluctant readers and non-readers alike. You also run a library for a women’s shelter, I believe? Can you tell us a little more about what kinds of attitudes about reading you run into on a regular basis from the teens you work with—and perhaps from your own teen daughter, if she’s willing to share?

Most of the girls (ages16-20) at the shelter and those who participate in agency prevention programs weren’t raised in an environment where reading is valued. They associate reading with schoolwork, and for many of them, school is a chore so reading isn’t fun. Even if they are mildly interested in reading, the next barrier is time. No one has time to read. Reading is what you do when you’re bored or forced to.

Many of my girls are required to read books that are culturally alien to them or because of their reading levels, the material is either too difficult or the material at their reading level is boring because it’s written for a younger audience. My challenge was to find relevant books written at a level the reader could manage. This is how I became a voracious YA reader. I didn’t read a lot of YA as teen.

Among my readers there are two divides: those who love urban fiction and will only read books with characters who look like them, and the storylines romanticize the lifestyles they want to have; the other group will avoid traditional AA fiction and the urban fiction and want to escape into worlds that are very different from the challenging, unglamorous lives they lead. In other words, they want pop culture and mainstream fiction with happy, carefree white characters.

You advocate for young women, for getting good books into their hands (and a whole lot more). Tell us about your library. What kinds of books do your teens devour? How do you reach reluctant readers? What kinds of books do they ignore? Where are the gaps, in your opinion?

Our library collection is roughly 80% books by women about girls and women of color. We have more than 3000 titles in our library. Our largest collections are YA, urban lit, women’s literature, and multicultural literature. We have an impressive children’s collection, but most residents and participants are teens and young adults, so I cater to that population. Most popular: urban lit, YA, and pop culture titles in that order. As I mentioned before, we have two major camps: those who only identify with books that mirror their culture and those who want to escape it.

We have what we call a Tween section. This is where we have fantasy and science fiction suitable for young readers through adult. Think Harry Potter. These titles don’t move despite me building and diversifying the authors and storylines. If a girl doesn’t already read Twilight or Potter, she’s not likely to be converted.

When I ask why they aren’t interested in these books, the most common answer is magic and fantasy aren’t real and therefore boring. Extended translation: “What does fantasy have to do with me?” What they don’t say is that fantasy and science fiction are just more worlds where they are absent. How many black people are slaying dragons?

Having said this, I don’t want readers to make a broad assumption this is true of all black readers. We are not monolithic. I work with a particular population of urban youth who live in depressed areas.

While there are people of color writing these kinds of books, my girls haven’t been exposed to them. And these writers are underrepresented in the publishing industry so while the industry is saying we won’t read these books, it’s in part because readers don’t expect to see themselves in these books.

Tell us a little about the reactions the teens you work with have to the books they read as they become stronger readers. What effect do the books have on them?

Among the residents, I often don’t get to see this transformation because this population is transient. What usually happens is if I’m lucky enough to recommend the right book, the young woman will come back asking for more books. If a resident finds a book she really likes, she’ll tell other residents and the book is circulated. I’m always on the lookout for the readers because peers have a greater influence on each other. When I hook a reader, she usually attracts more potential readers to the library.

What I’ve learned in the years I’ve been at the agency is to not focus on immediate results. My job is to plant seeds. It doesn’t matter if I see them become full trees.

Why is multicultural literature important to you? Why do you think it’s important for kids and teens?

Because I am a person of color, I live a marginalized existence. We are the “other.” There is a standard and I’m not it, and since I am not the standard, I’m often absent in arenas, whether it is the media, workplace, or literature. Multicultural literature matters because in literature, I have a voice, when in my daily life, I’m ignored or silenced.

We have stories of our own. We have something to contribute and it is important that we are part of that larger conversation among all people. I focus on women writers of color in order to teach my girls that their voices matter, that their stories matter, and they have something to contribute. It is important for kids and teens to know they are not invisible.

This year’s Teen Read Week theme is Reading beyond Reality. I, being a fantasy buff, love to think of that in terms of reading fantasy, but there are plenty of ways to apply the idea. What ways would you encourage readers to read beyond reality?

Glad you asked. One way I encourage readers is to introduce them to works beyond their reality. If we limit ourselves to only our experiences and what is familiar to us, we are boxing ourselves in. While fantasy isn’t popular, when I can, I suggest speculative fiction, fiction that has elements that are science fiction, fantasy, or magical realism at a level a girl can relate to such as Zetta Elliott’s A Wish After Midnight or Octavia Butler’s Parable of the Sower and Nalo Hopkinson’s Brown Girl In The Ring.

You mentioned that you are just getting into fantasy yourself. What kept you from reading it in previous years? Have you always been a big reader since childhood, or did you come into it later? Did you ever have trouble finding something “relatable” in fantasy? Has that changed lately, and if so, how?

One of the reasons I am a literacy advocate today is because in many ways, I am like the girls I mentor. While my parents bought us books, reading wasn’t actively promoted in our house. I read in order to do well in school and sometimes because I enjoyed it but I didn’t fall in love with books till much later. I didn’t read fantasy beyond Mrs. Frisby and the Rats of Nimh simply because I wasn’t exposed to more fantasy books, and when I was older, like my girls, fantasy held no interest. These books didn’t have characters that looked like me, and my limited knowledge of the genre was what I knew about children’s books. Well, I wasn’t a child so why would I want to read about magic and fantasy worlds?

In 2007, I met a reader, a professor who was a big time Octavia Butler fan. I became friends with this woman and she introduced me to a writer I instantly related to. I’ve been reading speculative fiction since. I don’t read a lot of fantasy but I don’t have the prejudices I had before. Recently, I began reading Justine Larbalestier’s blog. I read her blog awhile before reading her work. Once I read Magic or Madness, I knew I would likely read most if not all of her work. Zetta was a friend first, too, and A Wish After Midnight is one of the most impressive reads for me in all YA lit. When I became active in the blogging community, I was exposed to fantasy so while my own reading was limited, I was listening to my peers, picking up titles, reading the reviews and shelving these books, ready to recommend them to the girl who would want them.

Tell us about your Color Me Brown challenges. Do they help to draw attention to writers of color and books about people of color?

Color Me Brown was a response to the Liar book controversy. One of the positive things that came out those public debates was a frank discussion about lack of representation and promotion of books written by and about people of color. To many white readers, this was news. For people of color, it’s been a long-standing battle. In one of my rants, I complained about how difficult it is to find a review about a book by or about POC. I argued I’d better start writing more reviews if I wanted to read them. Now, I’m not one to complain without taking action, and that is how CMB was launched. I challenged readers to join me in blogging brown. The challenge was greatly supported. We received more than 100 links to POC reviews in just than 30 days. I’ve followed up the challenge with a weekly CMB feature where I post links from around the web about books by and about POC.

I think CMB, like our other challenge CORA Diversity Roll Call, is positively affecting what is being promoted in the blogosphere. I believe you and I met because of Color Me Brown. [Stacy: Indeed, that's true!] I know I’ve met and we have gained more readers at Color Online because of CMB. I continue to see reviews on blogs after the challenge ended. Many readers didn’t treat CMB like a one-time challenge; they’ve made a conscious shift in what they are reading and why.

One of the things I wanted readers to understand about reading multicultural lit is that reading in this vein doesn’t mean reading something you don’t enjoy, can’t relate to, something that is below your standards or interests. POC writers are writers first. They write all genres. Simply because a writer is a person of color doesn’t mean that race or ethnicity is the focus of the work. It means that race or ethnicity in some way informs the read.

What can allies do to support your mission?

I’d like readers to continue or begin reading and reviewing titles written by people of color and participate in our CORA Diversity Roll Call meme. Tell publishers and bookstores that you want greater diversity on the shelves and in the catalogs. Request more multicultural literature is on display and on the shelves at your local library. Teach your children and encourage your teens to look beyond obvious differences and enjoy what it means to see the world from someone else’s perspective. Support POC writers. Buy their books. When you donate to your school and library, include multicultural literature.

To support us directly, we gladly welcome your donations. I have passion overflowing. Unfortunately, that’s not the case with our resources. While the agency loves what I do in the library, we receive no funding. Gently used and new book donations help me introduce readers to works they might otherwise never know.